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"Daca am invata din fiecare infrangere am fi o natie de intelepti" = "If we would learn from every defeat, we would be a nation of wise people". - Nice words, who may have been told by some famous Romanian, but this expresion isn't the Romanian national motto. From what I know we don't have a national motto. If anyone knows otherwise, please come with some proofs/links. MihaiC 06:43, 1 Apr 2005 (UTC)
Guys I'm glad someone is doing this job. Keep up the good work!
P.S. That's right, we don't have a national motto.
Paul Ivan Cluj, Romania
So, that means we are a nation of idiots? When we will have more dignity we will be treated better as a nation. Look how distorted is our history in this encyclopedia. It is written by Hungarians, Bulgarians and others, not by us.
Antonio Agoura Hills, CA
The term dominator used for Alexandru I. Cuza is not right and definitely does not convey the right meaning. The correct term (and I see it has an entry in en.wikipedia) is domnitor translated either as "ruler" or as "prince" (the former i saw in K. Hitchins, the later in some Cambridge books). Another error : PD was formed in 1991 (october) as FSN-Roman (after old FSN split up in FSN-Roman and FSN-Iliescu that later became FDSN, PDSR and PSD) and changed its name in 1993 as PD (after a merger of FSN-Roman with a number of parties). The swap of Dobrudja versus Southern Bassarabia was agreed upon. It was not an invasion as portrayed in the article, but it was written in the Berlin Treaty --Xanthar 23:11, 10 May 2005 (UTC)
"During the 1989 revolution (the term "revolution" is contested by many)" --What does this mean? Who contests the term, and why? 131.104.249.87
I'm not sure I agree the way this part is formulated:
The official language is Romanian, a Romance language of the Italic subfamily of the Indo-European family of languages, which are also called Romanic or Romantic languages. This language family includes French, Spanish, Italian and Portuguese; its languages are spoken by about 670 million people in many parts of the world, but mainly in Europe and the Western Hemisphere.
I believe Romanian counts as a Vulgar Latin language and not as an Italic language. I believe there's a significant difference between the two language groups.
And I think there are more people in Latin America who speak these Romance languages, than there are in Europe. No biggie though...
--Anittas 22:26, Jun 16, 2005 (UTC)
Romanian language (Daco-Romanian) is part of the Eastern Romance group.
Besides,Romanian language and grammar is the closest “proximus” to Classical Latin,keeping declensions and the neuter gender, unlike any other Romance language!!!
There are about 35 milion people in the world that speak romanian
I found sources that still don't agree on the number:
- 28mil
- 26mil
- 39mil!!!
- 26mil
- 28mil
List of languages by total speakers - 23-24mil
Personally, I think no matter how we do the count, there's no way there are 35 mil Romanian speakers.
Until we find a credible source, I think this line should go.
mouseman 20:38, September 6, 2005 (UTC)
the name Romania was adopted in 1859. By that time Rumân and Român were very clearly differentiated (actualy i think Rumân wasn't even circulating by that time) . so the name Romania does not come from Rumân (serf) but from Român (romanian). If anyone wants to state that Romania comes from Rumân (meaning 'serf') as opposed to Romania comes from Romanian, from latin Romanus/Romania, better bring solid evidence/theory. -- Criztu 3 July 2005 14:27 (UTC)
The name Romania was officially adopted in 1866. Until then the official title was "Principatele Unite ale Ţārii Româneşti şi Moldovei". Român comes directly from Roman and the term was coined in the late 18th century (although it has been in use designating Wallachia since the late 15th century). Romania comes from Românie/Rumânie, meaning village/community, which in term comes from Romanus/Romania. (Rumân (serf) also comes from Românie, first meaning villager, later being used only for serfs). Therefore, you can assert a common ethymology, but nothing more.
Someone with more knowledge about that era could maybe have a go at rephrasing the parts of the History section that deal with what happened after WWII - it seems much more emotive than desirable. I removed a reference to "Bolshevism in Hungary and Russia" which at this point seemed only an overemphasis of the importance of the Hungarian Soviet Republic.
KissL 6 July 2005 15:42 (UTC)
A tiny bit off-topic for this article, but I don't know where else to ask or remark. There seems to be no article on the present day portion of Romanian known in English as Moldavia. Moldavia is about the historical prinicipality, most of which is now part (most) of the Republic of Moldova. Is there an article somewhere that I am missing? If not, we should probably start one at Moldavia (Romanian province) or some such. Is there a better word to use for this than province? -- Jmabel | Talk July 8, 2005 05:31 (UTC)
If you look at the regional color map, it's pretty clear that the split between the Republic of Moldova and the region in Romania by the same name is about 50/50. Most people that I speak to on the subject refer to to both as Moldova these days, not Moldavia. —Preceding unsigned comment added by TMLutas (talk • contribs) 15 Dec 2005
I must say that I don't care too much for the CIA map that depicts Romania. On that map, the two historical regions of Wallachia and Transylvania are both represented in writing, however, Moldavia is not.
That map is biased. It leaves many Moldavian cities out. Suceava and Botosani are not showing, though their population size is not too far from the size of Targu Mures and Sibiu.
Is it possible to find a better map, or do we have to stick with this one?
I notice that Bogdangiusca recently removed, without comment a lint to the Romanian Group for an Alternative History Website. Bogdan, was this a matter of the site being a bad source, or too narrow to be attached to this article, or what? Should it be linked somewhere else? -- Jmabel | Talk 17:51, July 10, 2005 (UTC)
-- All Romanians know it as 237,500 km²
-- Encarta says: 237,500 km²
-- http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Romania says: 238,319 km²
-- http://fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/Roumanie says: 238,390 km²
-- The Foreign Office says: 238,391 sq km
http://www.fco.gov.uk/servlet/Front?pagename=OpenMarket/Xcelerate/ShowPage&c=Page&cid=1007029394365&a=KCountryProfile&aid=1019744931956
-- BBC says the same:
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/europe/country_profiles/1057466.stm
-- The French Foreign Ministry says: 237,500 km²
http://www.diplomatie.gouv.fr/fr/pays_zones_geo_833/roumanie_238/presentation_roumanie_1268/donnees_generales_1120.html
— CIA Factbook says: 237,500 sq km
http://www.odci.gov/cia/publications/factbook/geos/ro.html
This f----ng country has no OFFICIAL site with official data!!!!
Please make some effort to find the real number. Thank you.
Currently, the surface of Romania is 238,319. This is the number used by the Government. This is after the 1999 Tisza floods, and some changes in the borderlines with Hungary, after the 1997 treaty. The 237,500 is 1975 data. Too old!
WHERE does the Gouvernment say that??? The URL please!!!!
Then: the UK is right. The CIA and the French are wrong. Geez.
No matter 237,500 is 1975 data, but this is about SURFACE, not People!
Don't make me sick, the 1997 Treaty has NOT CHANGED any border!!! I'm Romanian and I live in Romania and I should know this better than you!!!
Where comes this extra terrirory from??? REFERENCE PLEASE!!!
Wikipedia in Romanian language says 237,500 !!!
http://ro.wikipedia.org/wiki/Geografia_Rom%C3%A2niei
In any case, the appropriate thing for Wikipedia to do is not to pick one number and claim it as TRUTH, but to report the conflicting numbers given by reasonably authoritative sources, and cite those sources clearly in a note. -- Jmabel | Talk 23:51, July 19, 2005 (UTC)
The extra territory comes from changes in riverbeds considered as the border. Romania has a lot of natural borders, so variations in territory are quite significant (especially in regards to Tisa/Tisza that changes its riverbed about every 10 years and the deltaic area, where canals change their riverbed each spring). The treaty of 1997 DID change territorial sizes, as it reduced the size of the "neutral zone" (that was previously made excessively large by the former communist regimes), so both Hungary and Romania won some territory (you can calculate how much, both Romania and Hungary won the same - even if "it makes you sick"). Plus, there's a Delta, that's constantly expanding towards the sea, about 2-5 linear meters yearly, adding to the territory. Plus, there is a maritime exclusion zone, that's also considered Romanian territory, different than in 1969, when the 237.500 was correct. This figure was used in the 1971-1972 textbooks, that continued to be reprinted and used in schools until 1996. That's why this figure is used so much. CIA uses approximations, and it's been wrong countless times. Encarta uses CIA data. I think we should believe the Romanian data. After all, it's used in all calculations, including taxes. The reference is Institutul National De Statistica al Romaniei, INSSE. Or any other Romanian governmental site. And, because you live in Romania, that doesn't make you a guru in Romanian problems or geography.--Xanthar 12:37, 20 July 2005 (UTC)
I know this is not scientific data because I don't have the documents but my high school Geography teacher told me some years ago that the 238.391 sq km is the correct figure because in the comunist period there were people reporting smaller figures in order to pay smaller taxes. So I think Bogdandiusca is right. Either taxes or agricultural reports (or bouth). Paul I —Preceding unsigned comment added by 193.231.19.6 (talk • contribs) 24 January 2006
Recent addition says INCSDMPS claims that in 2014 Romanians will have an average gross monthly wage of 1,400 euro, but there is no citation. Please, I presume they said this in some published work, cite it. Or cite a newspaper report. Or something! -- Jmabel | Talk 05:51, August 10, 2005 (UTC)
Recent edit roughly doubled the claimed percentage of Hungarians in the population, from 3.6 to 6.6. Also increased the percentage of Gypsies, from 1.47% to 2.5%. The new numbers actually sound more plausible; however, like the old numbers they give no citation. Citation would be good. -- Jmabel | Talk 05:51, August 10, 2005 (UTC)
It seems that are error (ordering and data) in this table. Please correct it. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Romania#Largest_cities Paulnasca 19:05, 14 August 2005 (UTC)
There seems to be a problem regarding the location of Romania within Europe. The article Eastern Europe locates Romania there. I found the Romania article with "South East Central Europe". I corrected it, it was changed back and I was accussed of vandalism by an unknown user. If this is a controversial topic, I recommend removing any reference to Romania's location in Europe.
Actually, if you check the articles on Central Europe and Eastern Europe, they describe fairly well what the English-speaking world means by these terms. The statement "Romania is in Central Europe" is just factually misleading. "South East Central Europe" is a bad compromise, because not only does it still suggest that Romania is in Central Europe somewhere, but it also confuses the reader totally, and sounds patent nonsense (see Ahoerstemeier's edit summary).
My version was "lying partly in Central, partly in Eastern Europe" (referring to Transylvania and the rest of Romania - and I deliberately avoided mentioning the Balkans, because that is a culturally loaded term, and is not entirely appropriate for Wallachia). I'm as sure as anything that this was perfectly NPOV, and I can't see what's wrong with it (apart from some people being taught in school that Romania is in Central Europe, but this just doesn't change facts, does it?)
Oh yes, Greece is not called Eastern Europe because it is called Southern Europe instead. Similarly, Scandinavian countries are Northern Europe (which is pretty straightforward IMO, if you look at the map). That's got nothing to do with the fact that "Central Europe" and "Eastern Europe" are politically loaded terms. KissL 16:23, 12 August 2005 (UTC)
Actually, I'll be more than happy to leave this matter to you guys. I just came around this page via the contribution list of one of the anons who happened to vandalize Hungary population figures and percentages first before turning up here and copypasting web content... If you feel that Southeastern Europe is neutral, I'm ok with it, though my English-speaking self inside cries "Balkans" when I hear that (and that's where it redirects too) - which is even somewhat less appropriate for Romania than "Central Europe", IMO. KissL 16:10, 15 August 2005 (UTC)
Guys, don't violate others' copyrights. I'm talking about this (this time). KissL 16:40, 12 August 2005 (UTC)
Should we mention annual occasions that are generally observed/celebrated, but are not days off from work, such as Marţişor or International Women's Day? (Hey, no article on Marţişor, did I spell that wrong?) -- Jmabel | Talk 07:21, August 13, 2005 (UTC)
I think we should. Some companies do give days off, and organize parties on those holidays. Oh, and it's spelled Mărţişor --Xanthar 20:36, 13 August 2005 (UTC)
There have been a lot of very poor (mostly anonymous) edits to this article in the last 12 hours or so, lately, and right now I don't have the patience to sort through them. If someone else will step in, it would be greatly appreciated.
Not true. There are the Rumantsch people in Switzerland and also the people of Romagna in Italy. bogdan | Talk 18:52, 15 August 2005 (UTC)
A short message to KissL: you either are either you are too ignorant, but no way you like Romania, I've read that you are HUNGARIAN so I see that you hate Romania very much since you still change the name of Romania in Rumania, not other people to understand that our name shows that we are a LATIN people, and belong to Central Europe more than other people which doesn't have any connection with Europe, more with Asia like your people and came on horses only 800 years ago, STOP INTERFERING WITH THE PEOPLE OF ROMANIA, why you hate us so much? and as a hungarian you keep try to modify the reality from another country that is not yours, more you try to change the actual state between countries, saying that Transylvania belongs to Central Europe but the rest no? THIS IS A NON-SENSE, now that also Romania will joint EU from 2007, you are just A HUNGARIAN IRREDENTIST, you should lern some facts:
1. Romania is a central european country (just look on the map) and learn some history man! romanians were here from more than 2000 years, and were christians from the beginng, when other people were still under developed in the steps of Asia drinking hourse milk!
2. Our name is ROMANIA not Rumania, and shows our latin origin, our brothers are italians, french, spanish, portugal, don't try to change our name at least this RESPECT to have
3. don't forget that Romania is 3 times bigger than Hungary and we will be the 7th nation of the EU
--
Someone ban this Monor! --Anittas 17:43, August 16, 2005 (UTC)
If you can block his IP, then please do it now. Block everything you can block: IPs, his motherboard number, if you have access to it; and whatever. And you should have let my insult stay where it was. --Anittas 19:11, August 16, 2005 (UTC)
The Romania article is already a mess. Now he came along and make things worse. Our article is often victim of vandalism. Perhaps it would be best to write a clear, concise, and well-written article, and then lock it. Otherwise people will keep adding things that shouldn't be a part of the article. --Anittas 21:37, August 16, 2005 (UTC)
Actually, while "no personal attacks" is policy, "remove personal attacks" is only a guideline, currently even disputed. But if someone prefers to remove personal attacks, they definitely shouldn't choose to leave some personal attacks alone — especially not the ones which are bound to appear in a number of edit histories. (And see Gangleri's comment above to see what this is causing.)
My latest edit to this article was four days before the above "short message" was written. I think no further response is needed. :-) I'm happy to leave this article to the numerous sensible Romanian editors who are now active around here. KissL 10:22, 17 August 2005 (UTC)
He started the madness again. We need a Romanian moderator to step in and clean the mess. That Tax-Taxes dude won't do anything. Bogdan, can't you do anything? Can't you ban the guy? It's perfectly clear that he's not interested in compromising with us, nor is he interested in holding a dialogue. Just ban him!
And yes, Kiss, Tax-Texas was doing a double standard there when he removed my insult, yet allowed the other insults to stay. Go figure. These cowboys can be quite funny, at times. --Anittas 11:37, August 17, 2005 (UTC)
These recent edits made it through, being immediately followed by vandalism, which got reverted without this. I don't know about the exact inflation data, but I somehow don't trust anon editors on this page these days... KissL 11:32, 17 August 2005 (UTC)
Hallo!
Let me tell you some things from my point of view as a GERMAN.
1. ROMANIA is a CENTRAL EUROPEAN country. We, the germans, we thing about us that we are from Western Europe (remember West Germany?) I've been to Romania several times and the people there are not less central europe as their neighbours from Hungary. Since Hungary is considered being part of Central Europe then also Romania is to be considered also. Just a few more remarks, Romania is a diverse country, the biggest in the area and compared with Hungary which I have discovered of incredible small size and flat, just flat, no diversity in population due to the hungarization of the minorities, for example in Hungary the official statistics shows 6.7% Rroma (GYPSY = Zigeuner) but they say that are only 2%, I mean there are more than 600000 people!? where is the tolerance? In Romania every minority has its own man in Parlament, in Hungary? there is not a single one!
2.This will be proved when Romania will joint EU, then Romania will become a fully Central European country, then Ukraine and Russia will become the East. This is JUST A SHIFT IN MENTALITY! But it seems that many peopla still have reminiscens from the PAST! Look at the hungarian KissL, he is a hungarian software engineer and what does he know about history? Nothing, he is a ignorant, but he is a proud hungarian and he wants to change the borders from Central Europe saying that only a part of Romania is a part of the Central Europe. IN WHAT EUROPE DO YOU LIVE kiss laszlo? you are not being tolerant at all with Romanians!
3. Romania is the major regional power in the region. This is proved by the strong economic growth, steady growth, biggest population. We the germans we invest a lot in ROMANIA because the real money are made there, from Auto industry to technology.
BUCHAREST, Romania (AP) - Romania's economy grew 5.9 percent in the first quarter this year compared with the same period last year, the national statistics office said Tuesday.
The service sector was the country's main economic growth engine main showing a 6.8 percent rise from the same period last year, while industry grew by 5 percent and agriculture by 1.8 percent.
Romania hopes to join the European Union in 2007. On Monday, Romania's central bank governor said that the economy was growing strongly and urged the government to refrain from further stimulating demand as it could lead to higher inflation.
Governor Mugur Isarescu said the bank expects inflation to drop to 7.5 percent for 2005 and 5 percent for 2006, down from 9.2 percent in 2004.
Hi, I'm from Belgium.
My point of view is that Romania may be considered a central european country.
The list is like this:
Bulgaria, Greece,+.. --> South East Europe (Balkans)
Romania,Hungary,Slovakia,Czech Republic, Poland, Austria --> Central Europe
good bye
Someone recently and anonymously and with little comment "corrected" all the statistics about international rankings. Since the citations were vague before (no year given) and are unchanged, I don't know what to make of this. Someone may want to follow up and see if they can improve citation here so this is more easily checked. -- Jmabel | Talk 15:37, August 20, 2005 (UTC)
Hello to all,
here is my view that I express freely, I guess Romania is Central European Country, if Hungary it is then also Romania which is far more cultural and far more attractive, is a central european country, that's all folks, by the way I'm coming from USA, so I guess I'm neutral
Thank you!
Let's leave it Europe though. --Gutza 20:26, 20 August 2005 (UTC)
That title just made me cough/laugh a good sip of mineral water all over the keyboard. Thank you Gutza, if it breaks, you're responsible . Dunemaire 15:43, 18 November 2005 (UTC)
AnonMoos 23:02, 20 August 2005 (UTC)
In English articles, they usually mention both versions of the name, though the Bulgarian version gets priority. Either way, this is not about using the English version, because none of the two versions are considered as English version. The Bulgarian version is most often used when describing the Bulgarian part of the region, and the Romanian version when describing the Romanian part of the region. --Anittas 15:37, August 21, 2005 (UTC)
I am Italian and I just speak only few word in Romanian. Romania is a beautiful country and I love Romanian people.
Basarabia pe cruce
Someone added a bunch of random remarks about Romania from around the web to this talk page. Mostly tourist brochure stuff, none of it particularly illuminating. I am in the process of removing those that are long enough to constitute clear copyright issues; while I normally do not remove material from talk pages, this is egregious and amounts to abuse of a talk page. -- Jmabel | Talk 04:47, August 23, 2005 (UTC)
While I'm at it: these several very similar anonymous "I'm from…(fill in the blank)…and I just love Romania…" or "I'm from…(fill in the blank)…and I'm neutral about this topic…" remarks seem somewhat suspect to me, especially one from someone claiming to be from the U.S. but not written in very good English. Between that and some of the weird recent pasting of obviously copyrighted material into the article and talk page, I am not extending my usual supposition of good faith to edits on this article and talk page, unless they come from a signed-in user with a track record. -- Jmabel | Talk 05:24, August 23, 2005 (UTC)
You have my blessing, if it helps. --Anittas 07:49, August 23, 2005 (UTC)
The last two items in the talk page (Romanian Intelligence and Romania, intre primele 50 de puteri economice ale lumii) are copyvios (Ziua, 13 iulie 2005 - ). Deleted them. This talk page looks horrible. Needs cleaning up. --Xanthar 22:04, 23 August 2005 (UTC)
Recent uncited addition; I'm not sure of the factuality: "Actually, the several billion dollar debt contracted by several Arab countries from Romania dates back to the same period (but it appears that Romania is today forced to accept a reduction of this debt, for instance in USA-administered Iraq)." I'm confused:
Anyway, as I say, I don't know much about this, but I don't think I know much more after reading this sentence. Can someone clarify/cite? -- Jmabel | Talk 06:06, August 26, 2005 (UTC)
It's "common knowledge" that becomes now evident, with recent events from Iraq.
With a "romania debt arab" search on Google I found this: http://www.arabnews.com/?page=4§ion=0&article=68683&d=19&m=8&y=2005 which corresponds to several romanian news from the last few days (in romanian): http://www.gandul.info/2005-08-24/actual/aurul_petrolul_si_regatenii http://www.phg.ro/stire.php?id=22333&cat_id=10
From what I know, Romania did a lot of constructions of energy infrastructure, of oil processing facilities (even after 1989 there were a lot of Romanians still working there), and it also sent education and medical staff (professors, physicians, nurses). In the Middle East and in Northern Africa.
I maintain that Romania was forced to do what it did. Can you imagine a poor country giving up 2 billion dollars for "humanitarian purposes" while most of its territory is flooded? I can't. I maintain that this phrasing is correct. You could even say "obviously forced" instead of "forced".
As you pointed out, while Iraq may be no longer formally under U.S. administration, the US certainly have full control. This is what I wanted to say. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Dpotop (talk • contribs) 26 Aug 2005
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