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Horrible photo, anybody got a better one that won't infringe any copyrights?VaneWimsey (talk) 23:39, 24 February 2011 (UTC)
Looked it up, says he is straight.
Discussion
The Internet Movie Database lists all the shows where Oscar Nunez has credits. It also lists the instances where he has gone by another name. Out of 15 listed credits, only 1 is listed with the "Nuñez" spelling.
Mr. Nunez has complete, 100% control over how his name appears in the credits of any TV show or movie he appears in. So apparently he's mostly okay with being known as "Nunez" rather than "Nuñez", and in fact seems to prefer the former to the latter.
And if he prefers "Nunez", who are we to presume we know better?
You may have missed this but part of the entries assigned to the Argentinian actor (Oscar Nuñez, as per imdb) are actually for the Cuban-American actor (i.e. "Malcolm in the Middle", "The Steve Harvey Show", "The District", "Grounded for Life", etc). This basically proves that the Oscar Nunez we are discussing has been credited as Oscar Nuñez indeed. --Asteriontalk 02:52, 26 September 2006 (UTC)
The only official site here (and IMDB has been known to make mistakes before) lists him as "Nuñez". And it wouldn't be the first time two people shared the same name, though this Oscar is more notable.--DrBat 17:16, 23 September 2006 (UTC)
There is also an Argentinian actor with the same forename and father's surname, Oscar Núñez. --Asteriontalk 23:14, 24 September 2006 (UTC)
Only the "same" if you are talking about the English alphabet spelling, Oscar Nunez, of either his name or the different one proposed for the name of this article. If you don't fix the sort keys properly, they won't sort together even if they are in the same category. If you don't include the Nunez spelling, some search engine searches will find one and not the other in some searches. If you don't include both of those spelligs together with Nunez on the same disambiguation page, information remains hidden. Gene Nygaard 02:29, 25 September 2006 (UTC)
Gene, you seem to have a problem with any diacritic. Your problem with users who may not find the right result could perfectly be dealt with simply by using a disambiguation redirect. --Asteriontalk 02:45, 26 September 2006 (UTC)
Well, in this article, a redirect already existed. Nothing was broken, right, at least according to your logic. Everybody could find it. It had already been fixed, ages before this requested move was proposed. The category sorting was already correct. So why in the world are you pushing for a change, especially to a spelling different from the one normally used? Gene Nygaard 04:34, 26 September 2006 (UTC)
For the sake of accuracy. In any case, I would like to remind you that I did not lodge this request myself. Extreme unction argued that Nunez has never used the alternative spelling. I then provided him with a succinct answer above on why I believe that this was not the case: The spelling has been used in previous credits (I ordered a rental copy of the 24 episode, I will even be able to provide a snapshot for further verification if required) and it is also used on the current NBC website, whose information most likely come from O.N.'s agent, therefore tacitly approved by the latter. There are maybe a multitude of reasons explaining why the tilde was never used on The Office series bur I still think that Wikipedia should use the more correct spelling. Best regards, Asteriontalk 07:00, 26 September 2006 (UTC)
So, what's this "accuracy" nonsense? Where in the world does the notion come that whenever a word is sometimes written with diacritics and sometimes written without diacritics, then the one with diacritics is automatically the "more correct" one? Where in the world does the notion that so far, when we have at least some evidence of exactly one web page uses diacritics in discussing a show which itself does not use those diacritics in the title, and the IMDB listings which do distinguish between spellings with diacritics and those without listing credits in 14 out of 15 as not using diacritics, that the one with diacritics is somehow "more accurate"? Why is something used 7% of the time more accurate than something used 93% of the time? Why does something so seldom used that so far the only evidence anybody seems to be able to find so far is one web page and one IMDB database listing out of 15 get to be "more accurate"?
Like I told Húsönd above (something he has not responded to), being able to "verify" (which is of course something different from truth of the underlying fact) that a reliable source has once spelled a name or other word with a diacritic gets you nothing more than a good argument that we ought to have redirect or disambiguation page link for that spelling. He acted like, and you seem to be following suit, that the mere verifiability of one instance of that spelling being used would somehow resolve the issue and answer the question at hand here. It does not.
I apologize for not having responded, I hadn't notice your comment above. Replying to it, I think that you are making no sense at all. How come you decide that "being able to verify (...) gets you nothing more than a good argument that we ought to have redirect or disambiguation page link for that spelling"? Gene, you are clearly impervious to opposite argumentation, and you let that your odd defense of the English alphabet (as you see it) compromise accuracy on Wikipedia. Frankly speaking, I'm used to your arguments by now and I already know that it's a waste of time trying to explain any position that goes contrary to your own. My position here is clearly stated and I'll just abandon this discussion. I am sure that we will meet again soon, in some other move proposal that involves any diacritic that you do not have aversion to. Regards.--Húsönd 02:36, 27 September 2006 (UTC)
You don't dispute the fact that it is verifiable that, IIRC, in 14 of the 15 roles listed at IMDB, he is listed as being credited as "Oscar Nunez", do you?
You don't dispute that in the other reliable sources, as well as in IMDB, which were listed as external links when this discussion, he is listed as "Oscar Nunez", do you?
So could you please show me where it says in Wikipedia policy that if User:Husond can verify one case where something different is used, that is a trump card, so everyone else should just throw the hand in? Gene Nygaard 03:52, 27 September 2006 (UTC)
Although I had vowed to leave this discussion, I don't think it's polite to leave questions unanswered. 1) No, I do not dispute that it is verificable that he has been credited as "Nunez", as I equally do not dispute that it is verifiable that he has been credited as "Nuñez". 2) No, I do not dispute that he is listed as "Oscar Nunez" in reliable sources, as I equally do not dispute that he is listed as "Oscar Nuñez" in reliable sources. 3) Could you please explain why do you keep on with this crusade against the diacritics, warring with all the editors that come across your unreasonable and stubborn positions, saturating us till exhaustion with your persistent arguments and futile attempts to manipulate Wikipedia's policies in order to excuse your attacks? Try checking this particular policy instead. Regards.--Húsönd 14:18, 27 September 2006 (UTC)
You might just as well have stayed away, if you are only going to answer the rhetorical questions and sidestep the real one.
Don't be lecturing me about policy, especially policy that has no applicability here, while you persistently ignore the policies which do apply here (WP:NC, etc.). Gene Nygaard 15:18, 27 September 2006 (UTC)
Where in the world does the notion "accuracy" is relevant in any case come from? The general, overriding naming conventions standard for determining which of several possible variants is chosen to fill in the one slot available for any article's name is not "accuracy". It is, in fact, this, set off in a box and in bold letters at the top of the main naming conventions page:
"Generally, article naming should give priority to what the majority of English speakers would most easily recognize, with a reasonable minimum of ambiguity, while at the same time making linking to those articles easy and second nature."
I do not have any problem with diacritics. I do have big problems with illogical reasoning such has been exhibited here, more convoluted even than the squiggles they try to stack a mile high atop Vietnamese letters, something I have run across far too often in similar discussions in other cases as well. Gene Nygaard 10:43, 26 September 2006 (UTC)
Gene, N and Ñ are different letters and are pronounced differently. Using Ñ is certainly more correct (and has been used by the actor and/or actor's agent before), as it offers a guidance to visitors. If I were really being pedantic, I would argue instead for Núñez, as the name is spelled in Spanish. As it is quite obvious that we are not going to convince each other, I do not think I have anything else to say to you. I respect your opinion but I cannot share it. We should let other people join in this survey and then wait for an uninvolved admin to decide. Regards, Asteriontalk 17:47, 26 September 2006 (UTC)
False. "Nunez" is most certainly not, in general, pronounced differently from "Nuñez" in the English language. Leaving the diacritic off does not imply any change in pronunciation whatsoever. Furthermore, "Núñez" could never be "more correct"; it is in fact patently incorrect, since there is no indication whatsoever that it has ever been used with respect to this subject. That even goes far beyond Wikipedia:No original research and into the realm of utter nonsense. To suggest so, just clearly indicates that you have no respect whatsoever for the accuracy of this encyclopedia nor for following the rules established by our naming conventions. Gene Nygaard 18:04, 26 September 2006 (UTC)
You're misreading my comments. What I meant was that a non-verifiable use would have been "Núñez" but we have no evidence of the actor ever using the diacritic accent. While we do indeed have it for the letter "ñ". The fact that O.N. has been credited as Oscar Nuñez does indicate that he does himself discriminate between both sounds /n/ and /ny/. In any case, that is academic. Nuñez spelling has been used before. There are no rules in wikipedia against using diacritics. If a majority of editors believe the name should be spelled using "ñ", I cannot see while this should not happen. Regards, Asteriontalk 18:14, 26 September 2006 (UTC)
Just how in the world does the fact that someone created an article here, at the normal spelling by which this person is best known in English, "indicate that he [the subject of the article, who had nothing to do with the article here] does himself discriminate between both sounds /n/ and /ny/"? There is no United States law requiring people who want to use that phoneme to put silly little squiggles on the letters they use, is there? What language police do you imagine us to have? There's no California law or New York law requiring a movie or television producer to put squiggles on a letter if it is going to be pronounced that way, is there? There is no law anywhere requiring any movie producer to use any particular set of letters whatsoever in listing credits in a movie, is there?
There are thousands of people in the United States who use the Nunez spelling and the "/ny/" pronunciation [and no, I have no intention of verifying that; any reasonable person knows that it is true, and I'll assume you fall into that category]. There may also be a few who use some other pronunciation, but I suspect they are few and far between, and don't recall ever hearing anyone use anything else myself. Gene Nygaard 18:59, 26 September 2006 (UTC) That's "use" in reference to their own names, in case my intended meaning wasn't clear. Gene Nygaard 19:11, 26 September 2006 (UTC)
Gene, O.N. has used that silly little squiggle in the past. It is basically up to us to decide whether this needs to be taken into consideration or not. Whether we respect this or give more weight to its most recent and successful role in The Office, where in the credits it is not used (but it is in the official website, etc). Asteriontalk 19:19, 26 September 2006 (UTC)
What's that got to do with the misinformation you've been spewing about pronunciation, and your speculation that he'd pronounce it different depending on how he spelled it?
We don't know that "he" has used them; we can perhaps imply that he did not strongly object to their use, but even that is really just speculation. All we really know for sure, and all we really need to know, is that on an occasion or two, somebody else has used them in his name, in a context which he was likely to be personally aware of, and that many times his name has been used by somebody else without them, in similar situations that he was also likely to be personally aware of. But those are situations that are "set in stone", so to speak—unlike a Wikipedia article, nobody is going to go in after the fact and change them on the films. But I don't see that whether or not he has ever used them is all that important; what is important is how people know him, how they'd look for information about him.
Besides, like I told you and Husond, all that gets you, even if "verified", is a good argument for including a redirect. Of course, somebody (neither you nor me nor the proponent of the move) had already created that redirect four weeks before this proposed move even came up. Any potential problems had already been solved, except for the misleading and dishonest changes by DrBat to imply that the sources listed used something different from what they actually used. Gene Nygaard 19:56, 26 September 2006 (UTC)
Gene, I would appreciate if you calm down a little, please. You are using very strong words and undoubtfully making serious accusations. As I have previously said, we should let someone else to express their views on the survey and an uninvolved admin to finally take care of the WP:RQM if it proceeds. The guy was born in Cuba, all his family is from Cuba and he speaks native Spanish. There is no misinformation on saying that a native Spanish speaker would pronounce his name as [Nunyes] (not [Nunyeth] because seseo, of course). I cannot understand your logic either: If the name is spelled "Nuñez" is certainly due to "somebody else" but if down as "Nunez", it is O.N.'s choice. You are making assumptions for which you have no verifiable evidence either. Regards, Asteriontalk 20:10, 26 September 2006 (UTC)
"the misleading and dishonest changes by DrBat". Yes, I have a sinister agenda to have the n in Oscar's name changed to an ñ! You've caught me and foiled my dastardly plans. --DrBat 20:26, 26 September 2006 (UTC)
Stop throwing out red herrings, useless information unrelated to the discussion here, which has to do with the spelling to use in the article name.
Just because you know strange words I've never heard of, even though you don't know how spell it "correctly" (the name of the Wikipedia article should be the "correct" spelling, after all, according to the logic you've expressed elsewhere), that doesn't mean that it has any relevance whatsoever to this discussion here.
What in the world does ceceo have to do with your claimed differences in pronunciation between this name spelled with an "n" versus an "ñ"?
What in the world does ceceo ever have to do with Cuban Spanish, which would seem as perhaps the most likely (but certainly not necessarily) what he would speak, in any case? Are you just trying to make the point that just because you know that some spelling is a "Spanish" word, and it is using all those fancy squiggles, that still doesn't necessarily tell us how various people are going to pronounce it? What's the big surprise in that? Not a whole lot better than sticking to the English alphabet, is it? Gene Nygaard 21:10, 26 September 2006 (UTC)
Z can be pronounced as [s] or as [th], the former is common in Latin America and Andalusia, where the tendence originated. Any other wikipedian would have appreciated learning something new (this is after all an encyclopedia). You simply grabbed the wrong end of the stick once again. I am just tired of your failure to assume good faith and offensive comments. Good night, Asteriontalk 21:21, 26 September 2006 (UTC)
I knew you were talking about the z; what is completely unfathomable is why you were doing so. It has no possible relevance of any kind whatsoever to either this nomination nor to your previous ludicrous claims that the subject of this article would pronounce his name differently depending on whether he spelled it "Nunez" or "Nuñez" in English. Gene Nygaard 22:27, 26 September 2006 (UTC)
Fair enough, Gene. On a different issue, it is *not* 14 out of 15 times spelled as Nunez in the IMDB, as you said, but most likely fifty fifty as I have already explained you, because most of the previous remarkable roles of O.N. (Malcolm in the Middle, 24, etc) were credited to Oscar Nuñez, the Argentinian actor. So that argument is flawed indeed. Regards, Asteriontalk 07:13, 27 September 2006 (UTC)
It most certainly is 14 of 15 times in the IMDB. That has already been verified.
No, that's not a flaw in my argument in any way at all. The fact remains that his is beyond a shadow of a doubt often credited as "Oscar Nunez". It doesn't matter if you verify one or a thousand cases where it is different, that in itself cannot decide the issue at hand here. That can only be a factor in our decision; it is not a deciding factor by any means.
Furthermore, there is no mention of Malcolm in the Middle in this article. There is no citation to any reliable source either in the article or on this talk page showing that this actor ever played in that series. There is no reliable source cited for your off-hand claims that IMDB is wrong. Just an absolutely prohibited original-research claim that the actor IMDB says appeared in some series did not do so, totally irrelevant when it comes to legitimately including it in the article, is all we have so far. It's just a non-issue, at least so far. It never could be the deciding factor, no matter if you can meet the criteria of Wikipedia:Verifiability or not, because clearly there are two legitimate possibilities, only one which can fill the slot for this articles name, and one or more others that will need to lead to the same information. Gene Nygaard 11:26, 27 September 2006 (UTC)
Did you even bother to check O.N.'s biography on the NBC website?
Nuñez's television credits include "Malcolm in the Middle," "24," "Curb Your Enthusiasm," "Reno 911," "The District" and "Mad TV." Most recently, Nuñez created and sold a television pilot to Comedy Central titled "Halfway Home." In film, he has appeared in "The Italian Job," "Reno 911: Miami," and "When Do We Eat?"
Most of those roles have been credited to the Argentinian actor by mistake (and, Gene, please don't you tell me there's no mistake because I have watched Nueve Reinas and Vivir Mata several times, and that Oscar Nuñez is definitely not the same guy as The Office's). As I said, it is 50-60% for Nuñez spelling. Best regards, Asteriontalk 17:01, 27 September 2006 (UTC)
No, I didn't bother to check that, and there was no reason for me to do so. That's not what Wikipedia:Verifiability is all about. All I was saying is that "Asterion says IMDB made a mistake" doesn't fly.
But, if you are going to take that route, let's have a little truthfulness, okay. Only two of those roles you claim are mentioned on the NBC website are credited at the IMDB Oscar Nuñez page and not at the Oscar Nunez page. 1) Malcolm in the Middle, 2) The District. In addition, there are your unverified claims above that two other roles should also be attributed to this article, but that remains to be seen.
So that makes it 3 out of 17 roles, with an outside chance that you could eventually get it to 5 out of 19, but no more. So, 50-60%? I don't know where you came from, but we have better math teachers where I live.
Of course, you are also presuming that it is IMDB who are wrong, rather than NBC who are wrong. That is not yet verified in any way. Since neither of the shows Malcolm in the Middle nor The District are NBC shows, I'd say that as a rough starting point, it is more likely that IMDB is correct and that NBC is wrong, than the other way around, especially when the IMDB database is a collaborative effort and the NBC web page is a one-author story primarily related to his appearance on one NBC show, rather than having a primary purpose of collecting information on all of his roles. Gene Nygaard 18:33, 27 September 2006 (UTC)
Even though IMDB has mistakenly attributed some of the Cuban-American Oscar's roles on the Argentinian Oscar page (and this isn't the first time they've made mistakes, fyi)? 'No mistakes' indeed. --DrBat 19:26, 27 September 2006 (UTC)
Relisting to gain better consensus. --Dijxtra 08:28, 2 October 2006 (UTC)
The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on this talk page. No further edits should be made to this section.
A user is reposting information about an opinion poll conducted by Fox News.
I contend that this poll violates Wikipedia policies on neutral point of view and conflict of interest.
The cited link is poorly sourced as it is not a published article by Fox News: it is a blog entry without attribution or editorial review.
The source is not widely published or reprinted on other sites or news wires.
The poll is not an official, randomly sampled, statistically accurate survey, as it is a web poll of Fox News website viewers, which can be manipulated with bias by the participants.
The poll and the results have a biased point of view. The poll speculates on the affect of asking the question and intentions of the judges, and the intentions of Nunez of asking the question. This could violate the Wikipedia policy on libel, if the speculation about the intentions of the judges and Nunez are false.
The Miss USA contestants drew the name of the judge randomly by draw.
Including the poll violates the Wikipedia policy on conflict of interest because it demonstrates the promotion of an outside interest by the editor that does not advance the interest of Wikipedia to maintain a neutral point of view.
Therefore, removing the poll and link is to enforce Wikipedia's overriding policies, is not edit warring, and is consistent with Wikipedia policy on Biographies of living persons.
173.55.67.241 (talk) 08:43, 20 May 2010 (UTC)
Oscar Nunez recently appeared on the podcast "Girl on Guy with Aisha Tyler." In response to Tyler's questions, Nunez responded that he first began living in New Jersey at the age of four. (Tyler specifically noted that the information in this article—that he moved there at the age of 14—is incorrect.) Additionally, the newspaper article sourcing that information makes no actual mention of Nunes's age at the time of the move. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 108.9.50.18 (talk) 00:46, 24 April 2013 (UTC)
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