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USS Mount Whitney to the 2023 Israel Hamas war article
Latest comment: 3 hours ago On 18 October 2023, Mount Whitney deployed from Gaeta with the Commander 6th fleet, Vice Adm. Thomas Ishee, and his staff, onboard "in support of U.S. operations" in the eastern Mediterranean Sea in waters off the 2023 Israel–Hamas war. This added to new deployments by the USS Dwight D. Eisenhower (CVN-69) aircraft carrier strike group and USS Bataan (LHD-5), USS Mesa Verde (LPD-19) and USS Carter Hall (LSD-50) carrying the 26th Marine Expeditionary Unit, joining the USS Gerald R. Ford 96.60.168.239 (talk) 03:18, 28 October 2023 (UTC)
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In Section: Reactions → United Nations - add: "See also: United Nations General Assembly Resolution ES-10/L.25" Don Stroud (talk) 06:09, 28 October 2023 (UTC)
Done.Selfstudier (talk) 10:46, 28 October 2023 (UTC)
Hey, I'd appreciate some input on this edit I've got a couple of ideas here:
Infinity Knight (talk) 11:04, 28 October 2023 (UTC)
BilledMammal, any reason why we should include the Israeli claim and not the Hamas claim on cause of death in the note? I tried to avoid all that by just clarifying he did not die in action, but if youre going to add the Israeli claim of a heart attack the claim that he was tortured and assassinated should likewise be included. nableezy - 03:17, 28 October 2023 (UTC)
As many countries held protests and rallies for palestine but no rally were directly addressed by any hamas leader, this may be one of a kind.i dont know if a leader and former hamas chief Khaled Mashal is still important or relevant but he directly participated virtually in a rally organised in Kerala's Malappuram. In a video, the Hamas leader Khaled Mashal could be seen addressing the people.He was invited by youth wing of Jamaat-e-Islami.Visuals from the event shows banners with slogans like “Uproot Bulldozer Hindutva & Apartheid Zionism”.
https://india.postsen.com/News/amp/1228026
(google for more sources) Mindhack diva (talk) 13:11, 28 October 2023 (UTC)
Yet another reference to decapitation has just been added, during discussion. There are now 18 references to decapitation/beheading despite the fact that the head of the Israeli National Center of Forensic Medicine, said "We also have bodies coming in without heads, but we can't definitely say it was from beheadings." Frankly, as this is a trope, the article appears to border on Islamophobia. O3000, Ret. (talk) 19:23, 22 October 2023 (UTC)
the article appears to border on IslamophobiaThis is such a bizarre accusation. There is no disputing that Hamas murdered civilian Israelis, including children, in cold blood during the initial attack. There is ample proof of this, such as the graphic photos of bodies recently released by The Media Line. Does it ultimately matter whether they were decapitated or not? Hemiauchenia (talk) 19:34, 22 October 2023 (UTC)
Support removing most of the content from that section and merging it with the discussion under the 10 October subheading. The two things I think worth preserving: that the allegation was repeated by President Biden, and the assessment by the Abu Kabir Forensic Institute. --Jprg1966 (talk) 22:23, 23 October 2023 (UTC)
References
Infinity Knight (talk) 12:06, 24 October 2023 (UTC)
Yesterday the Israeli government showed journalists video from various sources, which confirms pretty much all the claims made. , , thats CNN, the BBC and the Guardian. I'm left wondering why content is being removed rather than additional cites being added to support it. WCMemail 08:12, 25 October 2023 (UTC)
“ | In another clip, a militant stands over a man who appears to have been shot in the gut and hacks at him multiple times with a garden hoe. | ” |
“ | The government screened approximately 43 minutes of distressing content, including scenes of murder, torture, and decapitation from the southern Israel assault. | ” |
Both sections address the lead-ups to the war, and other essential information about the background. Additionally, would it better to at least move the "historical context" section to the front of the "events" section? HolyCrocsEmperor (talk) 14:55, 28 October 2023 (UTC)
at least move the "historical context" section to the front of the "events" section?That seems logical while we think about whether a merge would be good or not (there is some discussion about that up the page) Selfstudier (talk) 15:04, 28 October 2023 (UTC)
https://www.ynet.co.il/news/article/sj9aj5qgt#autoplay — Preceding unsigned comment added by שמי (2023) (talk • contribs) 14:53, 28 October 2023 (UTC)
The inclusion of the words "Hamas-run" when discussing the Gaza Health Ministry, especially in the context recording the number of civilian casualties, adds unnecessary skepticism as to the accuracy of the death count.
According to the Washington Post, "In previous wars, the ministry's counts have held up to U.N. scrutiny". This information is corroborated by a statement from Michael Ryan, the executive director of the World Health Organization (WHO)'s Health Emergencies Program, in which he is quoted as saying, "The numbers may not be perfectly accurate on a minute-by-minute basis, but they largely reflect the level of death and injury". The United Nations, international non-governmental organizations, and the Palestinian Authority of the West Bank all consider the Gaza Health Ministry "[to have] long-made a good-faith effort to account for the dead under the most difficult conditions".
Owing to these statements, the addition of the phrase "Hamas-run" adds unnecessary skepticism to numbers that are otherwise generally accepted to be objective by most neutral parties. The immediate removal of this phrase is imperative to maintaining the objectivity of this Wikipedia article, and it should be noted *explicitly* when dissenting claims are made by non-neutral parties (i.e. Israel or the United States).
I understand there's an implicit level of risk when using a source tied to a particular government, but the frequency of the phrase "Hamas-run" adds unnecessary scrutiny when our main objective is simply to encourage readers to take into account the potential risk of bias.
To the editors contributing to this page, I highly recommend that you take the time to consider the language you use, especially when it can potentially benefit one talking point or another. When discussing such a divisive issue, it is imperative to remain as objective as possible.
My source: https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/2023/10/26/israel-hamas-war-gaza-health-ministry-health-death-toll/45dcc3fe-742f-11ee-936d-7a16ee667359_story.html Stockrbonk (talk) 23:51, 27 October 2023 (UTC)
This is being discussed in an RFC up the page, can comment there if permitted.Selfstudier (talk) 10:37, 28 October 2023 (UTC)
The Ministry of Foreign Affairs recognized the Uruguayan nationality of Shany Goren Horovitz, the 29-year-old Israeli woman kidnapped by Hamas, after confirming that she is the granddaughter of Uruguayans, ministry sources confirmed to El Observador
Other sources in Spanish: Semanario Hebreo Jai, Telenoche, CNN, Infobae and La Diaria.
The Uruguayan government asked the Israeli government, through the Uruguayan embassy in Israel, to make every effort to secure the release of the 29-year-old woman. Accuratelibrarian (talk) 15:59, 26 October 2023 (UTC)
After another editor added the template pointing out the article length, I wanted to write down some suggestions along with an area for other editors to add ideas and mark down when they are done.
Feel free to add on and strikethrough anything that is completed; I will do what I can but I'm not the fastest editor of all time. - AquilaFasciata (talk | contribs) 20:43, 27 October 2023 (UTC)
since houthi already targeted isreal with rockets which was confirmed by the us and isreal and today the egyptian military said that investigations into the two drones that fell in Nuweiba and in Taba yesterday showed that they were heading from the south of the Red Sea to the north. so i think we should put Houthi movement in the infobox and put (minor involvement) أحمد توفيق (talk) 18:26, 28 October 2023 (UTC)
An example of a compact view of the table from the Ukrainian Wikipedia. The table in the English Wikipedia takes up a lot of space. Ucraniano2 (talk) 00:37, 29 October 2023 (UTC)
Under the Negotiations and diplomacy's Ceasefire/In support section, it says "The resolution received 120 votes in favor and 45 abstentions; 14 countries voted no."
This was initially correct; however, Iraq has since changed its vote from abstention to 'in favor'.
From a Reuters article: "Iraq later changed its vote to yes from an abstention after complaining of a technical difficulty, so the final tally was 121 votes in favor and 44 abstentions." 2001:569:588B:9A00:1939:57F2:FA10:50ED (talk) 21:38, 28 October 2023 (UTC)
7,703 killed Including: 3,595 children and 1,863 women Ucraniano2 (talk) 02:02, 29 October 2023 (UTC) https://palinfo.com/news/2023/10/28/857641/ — Preceding unsigned comment added by Ucraniano2 (talk • contribs) 02:03, 29 October 2023 (UTC)
https://new.thecradle.co/articles/what-really-happened-on-7th-october
someone add this to the article Chafique (talk) 13:13, 28 October 2023 (UTC)
Israeli army spokesperson Daniel Hagari claimed in a briefing for international reporters that Hamas’s main base of operations is under Shifa Hospital in Gaza City.“When medical facilities are used for terror purposes, they are liable to lose their protection from attack in accordance with international law,” Hagari warned.
Hamas uses Al-Shifa with its 1,500 beds and 4,000 staff members, as well as other strategic and sensitive areas - other hospitals, mosques, UNRWA centers, and more - as shields for its underground tunnel network, Hagari explained. Moreover, he added, in Al-Shifa specifically, Hamas runs parts of its command and control center in different departments, carrying out rocket attacks against Israel and other terror activities. “Hamas also has an entrance to its terror tunnels from inside hospital wards,” he said. “From different places inside the hospital, you can enter underground tunnels.
https://www.jpost.com/middle-east/article-770484
However,Hamas rejects Israeli claim over installations under al-Shifa hospital
https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2023/10/27/hamas-rejects-israeli-claim-over-installations-under-al-shifa-hospital Mindhack diva (talk) 21:37, 27 October 2023 (UTC)
Add Asem Abu Rakaba in commanders and leaders section who was air chief of Hamas killed by IDF on last night in an airstrike. [] Kkb091 (talk) 07:04, 28 October 2023 (UTC)
According to the Critical Threats Project, there is an incursion in the northwest corner of the Gaza Strip: https://www.criticalthreats.org/wp-content/uploads/Gaza-Clearing-Map-October-282023.png Some Hecking Nerd (talk) 01:59, 29 October 2023 (UTC)
I want to write a new essay about the background of the war (war in Afghanistan (2001–2021), World War I, World War II, Russo-Georgian War, Greek War of Independence and many other wars have an essay on the cause of the war) But I don't know what to write its name. Origins of the 2023 Israel–Hamas war, Origins of the 2023 Hamas attacks on Israel, Background and causes of the 2023 Hamas attacks on Israel, Background and causes of the 2023 Israel–Hamas war or etc? Parham wiki (talk) 10:54, 29 October 2023 (UTC)
Former US president Donald Trump and other Republican contenders have accused President Joe Biden of fueling the conflict between Israel and Hamas by unfreezing Iranian assets worth over $6 billion. Trump claimed that American taxpayer dollars helped fund the attacks and accused Biden of being weak on the global stage. Republican politicians have criticized the release of funds to Iran, arguing that it has contributed to the current escalation between Israel and Hamas.
— source
It seems to be appropriate for the WP article, section titled "Background". 176.200.72.198 (talk) 13:35, 29 October 2023 (UTC)
Abbas walked back his criticism of Hamas. Specifically, he no longer stands by the statement "Hamas did not represent the Palestinians". Thus, can that bit be removed from this article? Chupster811 (talk) 07:20, 30 October 2023 (UTC)
The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.
We should consider adding the USA as a belligerent on the side of Israel since it sent two aircraft carriers with its accompanying ships to the region. 31.141.33.96 (talk) 19:20, 28 October 2023 (UTC)
Why have the casualties in surrounding areas, West Bank, Lebanon, etc been removed? 75.118.14.101 (talk) 16:04, 28 October 2023 (UTC)
Should the information from the Financial Times (FT) be integrated into the Background section when introducing a figure like Deif?
Infinity Knight (talk) 07:25, 29 October 2023 (UTC)
References
There many more Palestinian armed groups which have confirmed their participation in the war, including for now the Popular Resistance Committees (Al-Nasser Salah al-Deen Brigades), and the Palestinian Mujahideen movement. There is also the Al-Aqsa Martyrs' brigades which i don't know why, but it was removed. It also appears that PFLP-GC is participating with whatever assets they have outside Syria, and so is As-Sa'iqa, with both participating in a meeting with other factions in Beirut, and declaring general mobilization. And finally, on a side note, PFLP, DFLP, and maybe PIJ should be abbreviated, no idea why they are fully written out with an abbreviation at the end, wikipedia generally abbreviates long names of organizations like these, especially when, like in the cases of PFLP and DFLP, the abbrevation is used more than the full name. Whatever748 (talk) 21:25, 29 October 2023 (UTC)
The month of war is approaching. Please add to the article a summarizing table (at least for the results of the month), as it was done in previous wars.
Gaza | Israel | Ratio | |
---|---|---|---|
Civilians killed | |||
Children killed | |||
Homes severely damaged or destroyed | |||
Houses of worship damaged or destroyed | |||
Kindergartens damaged or destroyed | |||
Medical facilities damaged or destroyed |
Ucraniano2 (talk) 04:47, 29 October 2023 (UTC)
Please add general information about the victims to the preamble:
The total number of dead on both sides is approaching 11,000 people, injured - up to 27,000 people. The ratio of dead children in Palestine and Israel is 110:1. About 1.5 million people are considered internally displaced persons.[1][2] [see «Casualties»]
Ucraniano2 (talk) 03:20, 30 October 2023 (UTC)
References
Hamas says around 50 hostages died in the Gaza strip due to Israeli airstikes. I suggest it should be added on the Gaza strip casualties as seperate from Gazan residents. And preferably according to nationality once we have more information and confirmation by indepedent sources.
-source PaddyMacConghaile (talk) 16:00, 29 October 2023 (UTC)
We have Israeli invasion of the Gaza Strip and 2023 Israeli ground operations in the Gaza Strip, any thoughts on how the war ought to be divided up? Selfstudier (talk) 13:51, 29 October 2023 (UTC)
Per the consensus here, I have indefinitely protected this talk page so it can only be edited by users who are logged-in, have 500 edits and an account age of 30 days. Ritchie333 (talk) (cont) 10:31, 30 October 2023 (UTC)
For reasons including WP:COMMONNAME, the article title is Israel–Hamas war. (I apologize for not seeing that earlier; see above. However, I have a follow up question.) Does that mean we should use "Hamas" when the the folks with guns and bombs from Gaza do something and should use "Israel" when the folks with guns and bombs from Israel do something? It makes it seem like the Gazan militants do not have the support of the Gazan civilians, but that the Israeli militants do have the support of the Israeli civilians. Unless we have citations to support that asymmetry, I think we are misleading the reader. —Quantling (talk | contribs) 00:27, 26 October 2023 (UTC)
It seems clear that Israeli actions are now against Gaza and not just Hamas, destruction of property, killing of civilians, siege, starvation, entering the territory, etc etc. So use of Gaza instead of Hamas where appropriate would seem correct.Selfstudier (talk) 13:00, 30 October 2023 (UTC)
Russia is evacuating people from Israel to Russia through its Muslim republics, which has caused mass unrest https://www.mako.co.il/travel-news/international/Article-4e95a360e5c7b81026.htm Ucraniano2 (talk) 18:15, 29 October 2023 (UTC)
Working on a larger edit, but I noticed that there a couple broken citations. Anyone have a moment to spare to investigate? They're sources #20 and #159. - AquilaFasciata (talk | contribs) 19:32, 30 October 2023 (UTC)
please mention this in the infobox. source: https://english.wafa.ps/Pages/Details/138766 Another source: https://www.aa.com.tr/ar/%D8%AF%D9%88%D9%84%D9%8A/%D8%A7%D9%84%D8%B6%D9%81%D8%A9-%D8%A5%D8%B3%D8%B1%D8%A7%D8%A6%D9%8A%D9%84-%D8%AA%D8%B9%D8%AA%D9%82%D9%84-35-%D9%81%D9%84%D8%B3%D8%B7%D9%8A%D9%86%D9%8A%D8%A7-%D9%84%D9%8A%D8%B1%D8%AA%D9%81%D8%B9-%D8%A7%D9%84%D8%B9%D8%AF%D8%AF-%D8%A5%D9%84%D9%89-1590/3036652
In addition, more than 4900 palestinians were abducted by the settlers before Oct 7 (more than 31 women, more than 160 children, more than 700 people with chronic medical conditions). source: https://www.aljazeera.net/news/humanrights/2023/4/16/%D8%A8%D9%8A%D9%86%D9%87%D9%85-700-%D9%85%D8%B1%D9%8A%D8%B6-%D9%88200-%D8%A7%D9%85%D8%B1%D8%A3%D8%A9-%D9%88%D8%B7%D9%81%D9%84-%D8%AA%D9%82%D8%B1%D9%8A%D8%B1 Just a human being 20 (talk) 16:36, 29 October 2023 (UTC)
Al Jazeera has been accused of pushing "Qatari propaganda" by many countries and organizations, including those in the Arab world, with the BBC describing its Arabic-language coverage as more biased than that of Al Jazeera English and supporting Qatari stances on regional issues, as well as giving favourable coverage of Muslim Brotherhood aligned Islamist groups.- from the Al Jazeera article. Considering Al Jazeera to be a reliable source on Palestine in light of all this is illogical. JM2023 (talk) 05:05, 30 October 2023 (UTC)
Editors should not rely upon machine translations of non-English sources in contentious articles or biographies of living peoplesays WP:RSUEQ, implying non-English sources' machine translations should not be trusted in contenious articles at all), but that's only the first of multiple problems.
Per WP:RSP, "Some editors say that Al Jazeera, particularly its Arabic-language media, is a partisan source with respect to the Arab–Israeli conflict." Wafa is a state-run agency in a territory with very little freedom of speech. And, as I said, which you have not addressed (instead only insisting with no backup that it is reliable), Al Jazeera is headquartered in Doha, Qatar, where there is little to no freedom of expression or of the press or of religion, plus it is directly owned by the Qatari government, an authoritarian regime that is a primary supporter of Hamas including through direct financing, to the extent that the current leader of Hamas resides in Doha amongst its high society. Even the BBC says Arabic Al Jazeera at least favours Qatari government positions and Islamist groups. There is no way that it can be considered a reliable source for Israel-Palestine issues. JM2023 (talk) 23:10, 30 October 2023 (UTC)
Is there a reason why that is not in the timeline? The sources are treating the violence in the West Bank as part of the same conflict. The strike on the mosque and the raids in to Jenin are being covered as part of this same conflict, why shouldnt it be in the same timeline? nableezy - 04:08, 31 October 2023 (UTC)
Editors should refrain from adding daily incidents. For example, Israel–Lebanon border could be summarized into "daily clashes have resulted in .... casualties.", instead of a daily life toll. Makeandtoss (talk) 11:01, 31 October 2023 (UTC)
@Infinity Knight: Care to explain how you "summarized and split" this section? Makeandtoss (talk) 13:49, 28 October 2023 (UTC)
In the historical context section, please mention the fact that most of the international community and human rights organizations still considered Gaza occupied territory as per international law in light of their blockade. This is mention for instance in the Gaza Strip article or the Israeli-occupied territories article. 2001:569:57B2:4D00:4D32:CD1B:9F06:4B4A (talk) 04:44, 30 October 2023 (UTC)
Why is Hezbollah listed as a belligerent in the infobox and why are Lebanon and Syria listed as locations? That 'incidents' have occurred involving all three is cited and covered in the body, but none of the sources used comes anywhere near the WP:EXTRAORDINARY claim that Hezbollah is now actively fighting as part of the war or that the war is taking place outside Gaza/Southern Israel. This two sentence article is employed to justify the claim that Syria is now one of the war locations, although it does not even mention Hamas or the 'main' conflict anywhere.
Sources should be clear, unambiguous and near universal to claim that any other group are active participants in the war, whether we are talking about the US or Syria. Pincrete (talk) 16:46, 27 October 2023 (UTC)
I've removed the references to Hezbollah, Lebanon and Syria in the infobox - whether Syrian and West bank deaths should be included, I leave to others. That these peripheral incidents are connected is properly covered in the article, but no source I have read says that they are part of the Isr-Hamas war at present. Pincrete (talk) 06:06, 28 October 2023 (UTC)
There has been debate on what caused the Israeli ground invasion into Gaza to be delayed, and some have the belief that part of the reason it was is due to the risk of having a second front in the North opened by Hezbollah, which possibly forced Israel to have to deploy more troops in the North as a precaution. I would be surprised if Israel were not concerned about possible 2nd and 3rd fronts - but that only shows the possibility of Hezbollah and others becoming belligerents - which no one would doubt. If they were belligerents, you and we wouldn't be writing about the 'risk' of a second front, you would be recording the murderous events happening there and we would have dozens of sources reporting the escalation explicitly - and presumably Bibi's widening of his original 'war declaration'. Luckily for all, we are still at the stage of ugly threats from all sides.
A source has to directly support the material you want to include in a Wikipedia article, not editor's own assessment that this or that entity is adopting threatening words and postures and - relatively minor - threatening deeds and counter deeds - which again no one doubts. Pincrete (talk) 07:44, 30 October 2023 (UTC)
The Map showcasing Israeli “control” of the Gaza Strip is borderline hilarious. We have no evidence that they have established a foothold, on the contrary, Al Qassam Brigades spokespersons and Israeli Media have both claimed that armed clashes are still taking place and Israeli forces were pushed back from yesterday. 93.112.196.152 (talk) 19:05, 29 October 2023 (UTC)
But I modified my original comment to indicate this is not your OR. Happy? nableezy - 20:25, 29 October 2023 (UTC)
This is WP:ORis a perfectly acceptable content-based reason to object to the usage of an image. ScottishFinnishRadish (talk) 21:50, 29 October 2023 (UTC)
Users need to voice their concerns regarding the map more clearly, as @Veggies: has stated, there is no WP:OR dispute, as the map cites reliable sources as to where the IDF has been involved in clashes inside Gaza Strip. If the concerns are regarding the naming "Gaza strip under Israeli control", then the users need to clearly suggest a renaming, instead of berating about removing the map. Ecrusized (talk) 08:43, 30 October 2023 (UTC)
Current extent of the Israeli invasion of Gaza, as the top of this article currently says. Editors reading reports of troop sightings, and then depicting them on a map, and/or combining a bunch of maps made at different times, are engaging in OR -- or more specifically, editors who post such maps on Wikipeida, are engaging in OR. Levivich (talk) 19:41, 31 October 2023 (UTC)
The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.
2023 Israel–Hamas war → Israel–Hamas war – The majority of reliable sources call it Israel-Hamas war without the year. There is no need for the year if there has been no other war between Israel and Hamas. Interstellarity (talk) 18:54, 31 October 2023 (UTC)
majority of reliable sources call it Israel-Hamas war without the yearis because the sources are news reports.
The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.
This war is not between Israel and Hamas, but a much broader conflict involving fighting with the Palestinian Islamic Jihad, Hezbollah (in Lebanon) and Houthi Militias (Yemen). Therefore, the name is a misnomer.
רמרום (talk) 13:01, 31 October 2023 (UTC)
Currently the hierarchy of sections in 2023_Israel–Hamas_war#Unconfirmed_or_disputed_reports gives the impression there are no confirmed or undisputed reports. Can someone please clarify the situation. I think there's one hierarchical level too many. fgnievinski (talk) 03:44, 1 November 2023 (UTC)
As a part of the "Axis of Resistance" they had fired drones and missiles at Israel. They should be added to the article and the beligerents section of the infobox along with the US as the attacks are very notable. reuters CNN New York Times Abo Yemen✉ 05:45, 1 November 2023 (UTC)
The result of the move request was: not moved. Early close – Clearly no consensus to move the article. No need to prolong this and have an unproductive move notice on a high-profile article. Adding a one-month moratorium message to Talk:2023 Israel–Hamas war/FAQ so that it is more visible to editors. - Fuzheado | Talk 17:38, 1 November 2023 (UTC) Fuzheado | Talk 17:38, 1 November 2023 (UTC)
2023 Israel–Hamas war → 2023 Hamas-Israel war – Place the belligerents in alphabetical order within the title. Given the nature of the topic, this should be discussed first to see if I'm missing something. InvadingInvader (userpage, talk) 00:30, 1 November 2023 (UTC)
It is generally best to list topics in alphabetical order, especially those involving different countries or cultures, as in Canada–United States border. Seems reasonable to apply the standard alphabetization practice here. — Red-tailed hawk (nest) 00:41, 1 November 2023 (UTC)
Literally nobodyseems inconsistent with a basic google search. — Red-tailed hawk (nest) 02:46, 1 November 2023 (UTC)
Nitpickery aside, yeah, RSes have written "Hamas-Israel" in the past, but does anybody call it that -- present, ongoing -- like as in the name of the topic they assign to it? (And not just an example in a story here or there.) Does any RS use "Hamas-Israel" consistently or predominantly, as the title for the topic? Even if some RS do, it seems undisputable that the vast majority of RS put "Israel" first (even those that call it "Israel-Gaza").
For whatever reason, the common names are Israeli-Palestinian conflict and the Israeli-Arab conflict, not the Palestinian-Israeli conflict or the Arab-Israeli conflict. Levivich (talk) 03:37, 1 November 2023 (UTC)
The House is set to vote on a raft of legislation this week related to the Israel-Hamas war that could intensify longstanding Democratic divisions.- Axios, October 31, 2023.
An open letter reveals internal divisions over Israel-Hamas war... Where does the disagreement over the Israel-Hamas war leave the party and the government? Journalists Tonda MacCharles of the Toronto Star and Stuart Thomson of The Hub weigh in...- CBC, October 30, 2023.
...more than three-quarters of respondents in the new poll said they’re somewhat or very concerned about the Israel-Hamas war leading to terrorist attacks in the U.S...- The Hill, October 30, 2023.
Israel-Hamas war in Gaza: What is the history of the conflict?- Reuters, October 30, 2023.
Israel-Hamas War - Israel Hits Dense Gaza Area, Killing Dozens; Says It Was Targeting Hamas- NY Times, October 31, 2023.
Folks who want to talk about what RSes call it, need to not pick out individual examples, but instead look at the RS's front page, and their page dedicated to the topic, to see how they title the topic. Otherwise it's just cherry picking examples, and we can find examples of all the variants. This will come up again in the next (post-moratorium, likely) move request. Levivich (talk) 15:40, 1 November 2023 (UTC)
The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.
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It seems to me that various countries are actively providing military assistance and/or support to the State of Israel in the framework of this specific ongoing conflict. Therefore, it seems to me reasonalble to include them as belligerents (or at least as supporting Israel). Countries like Germany (news source: https://apnews.com/article/germany-scholz-israel-aid-hamas-b38a3cf34895fbfc0c966bb27413886f), the United Kingdom (news source: https://news.sky.com/story/uk-sending-navy-ships-and-spy-planes-to-support-israel-and-prevent-further-escalation-12983313), the United States (news source: https://apnews.com/article/israel-hamas-military-navy-carrier-e648c53dc53a46e2e12950784ea5e8d2 / institutional source: https://www.defense.gov/News/News-Stories/Article/Article/3553040/us-flowing-military-supplies-to-israel-as-country-battles-hamas-terrorists/).
Moreover, it seems to me that Austria and the Czech Republic require monitoring in terms of future military assistance.
Obviously, this matter is debatable, but I urge you to consider it. ZeusMinerva25 (talk) 22:53, 29 October 2023 (UTC)
The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.
In addition to points made in previous move discussions - namely that multiple Palestinian factions and indeed the general population have been involved in this conflict - over the past 10 days since the last move discussion, other Arab countries (Lebanon, Iraq, Syria, Yemen, Egypt) have been directly involved in the conflict. Moreover, the name (Arab-Israeli conflict) is long established and well understood by the reader. The current title goes beyond inadequate at this point, it is outright misleading, making it wholly unsuitable. عبد المؤمن (talk) 13:46, 26 October 2023 (UTC)
The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.
Why is "2023" in the title? There is no other article called Israel–Hamas war to disambiguate from. InfiniteNexus (talk) 17:00, 27 October 2023 (UTC)
2023is an unnecessary disambiguation. A hatnote saying
This article is about the 2023 conflict. For other uses, see ...would suffice. The only reason I am holding back from starting an RM is because we've already had three in the past month. InfiniteNexus (talk) 03:18, 30 October 2023 (UTC)
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