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I would like to suggest an article on one of the gratest caligraphers in modern Japan, the master Seiseki Abe. Besides being one best shodo teachers in the world today, he's also an Aikido master, holder of 10th degree. A direct disciple of the founder of Aikido (Ueshiba), and at the same time Ueshiba's caligraphy teacher. His work is simply breathtaking. I recomend urgency on this matter due to fact that Abe sensei is very old.
I see lists of great calligraphers -- added his name (unfortunately in Romaji, only) ot the list. Nikevich (talk) 01:24, 28 February 2010 (UTC)
I strongly feel that Wiki should be using, as the main translations and page titles, the terms used by influential educators and scholars. I am proposing to use the following as the primary terms-- oracle bone script (not oracle script); Zhou bronze script (specifying Zhou if that is the period, since bronze is a medium for inscriptions from the mid Shang to Han and onward); clerical (not official or scribal) script; cursive (not grass or draft) script; semi-cursive (with running hand secondary) script; and as for kaishu, I cannot identify a standard term -- reputable scholars seem to use all three forms (standard, regular, & "kaishu"). For each script, the primary term should be used on each page mentioning it, while all the secondary terms can be mentioned once in a box on the main page for each script style.Dragonbones 09:13, 23 March 2006 (UTC)
If you're going to change the English names, you should move the articles as well!!! Right now you've basically broken our links to the Running script and Grass script!! -- ran (talk) 18:48, 24 March 2006 (UTC)
The brief references to the origin of seal and clerical script were misleading or unclear. Note (briefly) that seal evolved organically out of the Zhou bronze script, and contrary to popular conceptions, the style of small seal was already established before Qin Shihuang or Li Si were even born. Similarly, clerical script arose not from the official Qin script (seal) but from its vulgar counterpart. Furthermore, this evolution began during the Warring States period; thus clerical script was not born in the Han dynasty. Rather, it matured partway through the Han. I will be updating the seal, clerical and Chinese writing pages to reflect a more modern scholarly understanding, and will expound upon this, with references, in the relevant discussion pages in the near future.Dragonbones 10:01, 24 March 2006 (UTC)
After "The Regular Script (often called standard script or simply kǎishū) is one of the last major calligraphic styles to develop, emerging..." I've added "between the Hán and Wèi Dynasties, gaining dominance in the Southern and Northern Dynasties, and maturing in the Táng Dynasty. It emerged from a neatly written, early period semi-cursive form of clerical script." The reference is the authoritative Qiu Xigui (pp142-9) which I've added to the references section. I'll incorportate similar but more detailed information on the main page for that script soon.Dragonbones 07:45, 27 March 2006 (UTC)
Is there a reason the regular script sample shows 'shu' in simplified characters? It would be more accurate to show the running style with this allowable simplification, and this seems to conflate completely different issues (styles of writing and forms of characters) which those who aren't fluent in Chinese might easily misinterpret.
This is to correct a common misconception about ancient scripts. None of them, not even the Shang script, was fundamentally a carved form as opposed to brush-written. The brush has existed since Neolithic times, as evidenced by brush-marks in the pigment on painted potteries of the time. In the Shang script, characters for brush and book are present, and some of the oracle bones still have vermillion ink graphs on them (uncarved). The misconception arises because the vast majority of early writing has survived in carved form, which is of course because perishable wood, bamboo, and later silk and paper media didn't survive as well as harder ones. See Qiu Xigui (ref. on main page) for evidence. Dragonbones 01:34, 28 March 2006 (UTC)
There is a new image available Image:Japanese calligraphy.jpg if anyone wants to use it, I don't know anything about the subject, so I might put it in the wrong place. - cohesion 05:26, 11 May 2006 (UTC)
The top icon is not good. It is ugly and it is not in regular script as it claims to be.Hillgentleman 10:00, 3 September 2006 (UTC)
I believe this page should be renamed to Chinese calligraphy. Either that, or Chinese calligraphy should be a separate page. "East Asian" calligraphy is Chinese calligraphy. The only exception is Hangul calligraphy, which is (as far as I know from glossing over Hangul entries in international calligraphy competitions) written with Kaishu-style strokes. -- Миборовский U|T|C|M|E|Chugoku Banzai! 22:19, 19 May 2006 (UTC)
We have East Asian calligraphy for the same reason that we have Islamic calligraphy instead of, say, Arabic calligraphy. Although Islamic calligraphy is done in the Arabic alphabet, it is done not only by Arabs but also by Muslims of many other ethnicities, and is done in not just the Arabic language but also many other languages spoken by Muslims. Similarly, calligraphy is used by Japanese and Koreans to write in the Japanese and Korean languages. -- ran (talk) 02:56, 15 June 2006 (UTC)
... I merged Chinese calligraphy and Japanese calligraphy together in the first place because I found that 90%+ of each article applied to the other one as well. -- ran (talk) 11:45, 16 June 2006 (UTC)
Similar wiki articles is not a justification for renaming two separate things in my opinion. The articles should be separate or there should be a paragraph explaining the similarities.
--Sunawave 08:50, 27 February 2007 (UTC)
The image of brush holding does not look right to me. It seems too laxed. I don't know about other people, but my habit is to use the first segment of my index finger to control the brush. And the little finger should be on the nameless finger, not on the brush itself.Hillgentleman 10:09, 3 September 2006 (UTC)
What about the typical topics of calligraphy? Not a word on that. Can I safely say that the topics of Chinese calligraphy are classic and religious writings on the one hand, and Poetry and proverbs on the other? UncleMatt 12:28, 13 April 2007 (UTC)
As one of the possible meanings of the first character 草 can be "draft" (according to EDICT dictionary[note1]), I wonder if it woulden't be more logical to call it "Draft script".
Note: [1] Copyright (c) 1994 James William Breen http://www.physics.ucla.edu/~grosenth/manual.html Jyorudy 22:31, 1 December 2007 (UTC)
Before Vietnamese changed their writing system (I don't know when), they also might have notable calligraphers using Chinese characters. Once I saw old Vietnamese paintings which looks similar Chinese paintings, so if anyone in project Vietnam see this thread, please fill up the information on it. --01:00, 2 December 2007 (UTC)
Le Anh-Huy (talk) 02:33, 8 December 2007 (UTC)
777 —Preceding unsigned comment added by 208.49.141.68 (talk) 18:26, 13 March 2008 (UTC)
Chaps, this really is about calligraphy with Chinese characters, not 'East Asian' calligraphy. I'm proposing a re-name to Chinese Calligraphy, as is only meet and right. There's no reason why there should be a separate Japanese calligraphy article while this one is stupidly-named 'East Asian calligraphy'. The article on the characters is Chinese characters, with Kanji and Hanja as daughter articles, not 'East Asian characters'. The same should apply to an article on various written forms of those same characters. InfernoXV (talk) 20:58, 7 May 2008 (UTC)
In ancient China, the "書法" was not considered an art, but simply the (correct) way of writing. Its main goals were to ensure that characters can be read, to ensure that they are concise, and to ensure that the characters look good. Only recently was it considered an art, and calligraphers started departing from the aforementioned three goals. You can cite 田蘊章《每日一題每日一字》. Asoer (talk) 04:37, 15 July 2009 (UTC)
To be most helpful to users, the list should be of notable calligraphers and not famous calligraphers. Ding Shimei is a modern "calligrapher" who won modern rewards that are given by modern people. Such rewards and recognition isn't necessarily indicative of his level of calligraphy. The list in the article is for notable calligraphers that should at least be superior if not in the same league as Qigong. A criterion I recommend is that if people who are added are still alive, there is a high chance that person shouldn't be there. Also, there's a format to the list. If someone randomly adds a name that doesn't follow the format or is out of order, the added name likely shouldn't be there. It also helps if there's an article about that person. Same with Liu Bingsen. Don't let his high position like "Vice-Chairman of the Chinese Calligrapher Association" automatically make his calligraphy better. Such positions are often poor indicators of their level of calligraphy.
I know there's a lot of random people in the Japanese and perhaps Korean list. I'll look into it later.
But from now on, watch addition of new names, especially modern calligraphers. Asoer (talk) 17:15, 3 August 2009 (UTC)
Since the article is about calligraphy of four Asian countries, the article splitting and merging should not be unilaterally decided by one person. Raise the issue to WP:CHINA, WP:JAPAN, WP:KOREA, WP:VIETNAM. I don't see any discussion for the splitting decision.--Caspian blue 03:02, 21 August 2009 (UTC)
This is related to the debate about whether east-asian calligraphy is an art or not: I think there are other calligraphic traditions than simply brush-writing in the “big five” styles. I’m thinking in particular of the so-called Zen calligraphy, called Bokuseki 墨跡 in Japanese. I might be mistaken here, but I’m under the impression that bokuseki is 1) very individualistic and æsthetics-driven, thus closer to our idea of “art” than 書道 and 2) kind of lived outside the (past) rigidity of 書道 tradition. It seems to me that, in the tea ceremony, bokuseki is more popular as an alcove-scroll exhibit than pure shodō; if that’s true, it would be another point for bokuseki-as-art.
---lazy anon —Preceding unsigned comment added by 201.52.10.219 (talk) 23:48, 2 January 2010 (UTC)
Redone, added, moved, or displayed sections:
Consensual contributions welcome. Creation of article Korean Calligraphy welcome. Yug (talk) 02:47, 21 May 2010 (UTC)
The caption begins: "Scheme of Chinese calligraphy paper..."
It's plain that considerable thought and care went into preparing the illustration; there are considerate touches such as kind references to beginner's aids. However, the illustration can be improved. It seems likely that the creator/artist has an Asian first language. If I were learning that person's language, and could come anywhere close to that person's fluency in English, I'd be very happy, indeed!
This illustration, however, needs the help of a native English speaker; it definitely needs copy editing. As well, the layout could be improved. Individual blocks of text, in some instances, could be placed better (there are even some overlaps). For some mysterious reason, the right side is cut off, although when the .svg file is rendered in Inkscape, the text is complete. The .svg file includes a large Chinese character, located some distance to the right, which does not show in this Wikipedia illustration, and might possibly just simply have been forgotten.
While "Paper" is understandable as the title, when one thinks about it, something like "Traditional Document (Page? Sheet?) Format (or Layout)" would be more descriptive. The diagram on the right side, that shows where to start writing, and where the seal should be placed, is so tall and narrow that (except for color -- a very pleasant color, btw) it's hard to recognize as representing the paper. I tried to rework the diagram in Inkscape, and found that I simply don't know how to do many necessary changes (such as editing text).
The term "case" which apparently describes what's technically a bounding box (within which a character is written) is quite confusing. Whether "bounding box" is OK to use in such an illustration, I just don't know; it's a technical term in typography.
With my best regards, and hopes to start learning,
Nikevich (talk) 01:09, 28 February 2010 (UTC)
The caption of the photograph contained within the "Evolution and Styles" section needs some serious revision as the grammar is, no offense, pretty abysmal. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 96.28.78.34 (talk) 15:40, 6 June 2010 (UTC)
Qigong, although considered good in his time, is average at best when considering China's entire history (田蘊章(2006).《每日一題每日一字》). When I cleaned up the list before, I left him on, but he was on the very edge, the lowest common denominator. He is not in the same league as the rest of the people on the list of notable calligraphers in China. Seiseki Abe is still alive. It takes time, among other things, for one to be recognized as notable in this field. As a precaution against a conflict of interest, I recommend not adding people who are still alive. Asoer (talk) 22:25, 22 August 2010 (UTC)
The result of the move request was: page moved. The editing history currently under Chinese calligraphy will be swapped to East Asian calligraphy. Aervanath (talk) 18:05, 12 March 2012 (UTC)
East Asian calligraphy → Chinese calligraphy – East Asian calligraphy more commonly refers to the grouping of Chinese, Japanese, and Korean calligraphy. Chinese calligraphy is the common name for calligraphy with Chinese characters, where the Chinese refers to that script. If it's truly about East Asian calligraphy with all the East Asian scripts (which it is not), than there should be a section about Japanese and Korean calligraphy with their respective charachters in use in those cultures here with a {{main}} header. "East Asian calligraphy" is applied to the region as in calligraphy in East Asia as a whole. Google ( vs ) / Googlebooks ( vs / JSTOR ( vs ) give significantly more hits for "Chinese calligraphy" than to "East Asian calligraphy". Taking in account that East Asian calligraphy refers to the grouping commonly, it is even higher. The current page would be a disambiguation page.relisting see below. Andrewa (talk) 03:17, 27 February 2012 (UTC) --Cold Season (talk) 17:22, 19 February 2012 (UTC)
John Robert Morrison (1814 - 1843) accompanied Edmund Roberts to Cochin-China and Siam, as Chinese interpreter and translator. As he was fluent only in Mandarin, many negotiations where conducted by means of Chinese characters on Chinese black paper using white ink and pencil brush. --Pawyilee (talk) 09:57, 27 June 2012 (UTC)
With this table : " {{East Asian Calligraphy styles|place=right|size=60px}} "
— Preceding unsigned comment added by 84.123.39.175 (talk) 00:12, 25 October 2012 (UTC)
I reverted today a set of edits to the intro between 27 February and 8 March 2013; some were clearly vandalism by anonymous users, deleting material (also parts of words); other ones were partially in good faith, but were deleting the resulting nonsense instead of reverting the vandalism. Some deletions might have been intended and legitimate, but without an explanation I assumed otherwise. In particular, I restored the sentence "There is a general standardization of the various styles of calligraphy in this tradition.", even though it's rather vague and hard to understand - but I think it probably just deserves rewriting.
So:
--Blaisorblade (talk) 16:58, 31 March 2013 (UTC) I agree with Blaisoblade Mikhail.bulgakov (talk) 23:25, 27 June 2015 (UTC)
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