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I will change the first few lines on the attack section. All that was really required to join Ueshiba M.'s dojo in the early days were letters of introduction and not all had previous martial art experience. Those that did tended to come from Judo rather than striking arts. Interestingly when he first started teaching it was at the Omotokyo headquarters in Ayabe - the bulk of his students had no Budo experience. When Ueshiba began teaching it wasn't called Aikido but Daito-ryu and was not a new art. I also removed the "more agressive" designation for striking arts. Irimi can be very agressive and is designated by some Aikidoists as atemi (striking) waza. Peter Rehse 01:12, 17 November 2005 (UTC)
What is the policy on external links? Generally I can see broad based sites such as Aikiweb, some organizational sites, even things like the Primer, but some look like quite ordinary personal pages. It really is not that long to worry about but hey I'm curious.Peter Rehse 07:07, 4 October 2005 (UTC)
I really don't think this is the place for individual homepages. If they add something to the article then perhaps the article itself should be changed.Peter Rehse 00:47, 17 October 2005 (UTC)
My major problem with individual homepage external links, besides the potential length of the list, is the feeling that they act more as advertisment than information. Quite a bit of effort has been put into the Aikido article to avoid style bias and affect a NPOV. To get your dojo name out there, a laudable exercise, the Dojo listings at Aikiweb and Aikido Journal, are far more effective. If the person who added the last link insists then in fairness I will re-add the other deleted links. If you look at the general trend in other articles the number of external links tend to be limited to two or three. Peter Rehse 04:12, 18 October 2005 (UTC)
Under "Techniques," there is the line, "Aikido is considered one of the most difficult of the Japanese martial arts in which to gain proficiency since it has such great demands physically and mentally." While I personally train Aikido and agree it's difficult, I don't think this statement can be meaningfully confirmed. What does "proficiency" mean? I agree it's difficult to become adept enough in Aikido to use it for self-defense, but I still think this is too vague and perhaps self-congratulatory a statement.
No offense is intended. If anyone disagrees, please contact me. But I can't imagine that jujitsu, karate, or any other Japanese martial art is significantly easier to gain proficiency in. Otherwise I'll delete the line in the near future. Danspalding 02:10, 25 September 2005 (UTC)
I was also bothered by the line. Here in Japan yudansha rank in Aikido, Kendo and Judo take about the same amount of time. There are also forms of koryu that use techniques as or more "sophisticated" than Aikido. Same can be said for the philosophical underpinnings. As the original comment suggested the statement tastes of self congratualatory back slapping - what do other arts think of Aikido - and should be removed. It is opinion rather than fact.Peter Rehse 00:49, 26 September 2005 (UTC)
It is far easier to avoid a punch by using a standard block with your arm and then grabbing the other person's head and pulling it down into a rising knee than it would be to say, blend expertly with the attack, move at the very last second to avoid/deflect the punch, move to just the right postion up next to the attacker, pivote while under complete control and throw them with an irimi-nage. I could teach you to do the karate block/knee smash in about an hour. You'd be very good at it. The Irimi-nage? Uh, not in an hour. I think that's the point the author was making.
Hi. Someone (who must not speak Chinese) suggested that the ki in aikido was the same as both the Qi in Qi Gong and the Chi in T'ai Chi Ch'uan. This is not true (although I can understand the mistake; the Chi in T'ai Chi is actually pronounced ji -- thank you Wade Giles -- and doesn't mean the same thing at all). I corrected this mistake. I also edited much of what was written before for clarity and grammar. And added a bunch of discussion on how various schools see Ki -- the old article essentially emphasized the spiritual Aikikai interpretation of Ki which is by no means the only one.
Hopefully you guys can look it over and improve it.
added some details for ki - as i dont know anything about the chinese version i thought - this the better place :) (slartibartfasz)
Perhaps I'm being needlessly contentious, but you say "No article about Aikido can be complete without a discussion of the concept of Ki"--a statement which contains a link to Qi but not a discussion of it. Is this irony unintended? Why not add at least a brief discussion of Qi on the aikido page (maybe leaving the more lengthy discussion in place)? --KQ
I just recently linked the reference to Ki to Qi because I knew the entry existed. Someone more educated on such a subject than I needs to tie this in, I'm afraid. Better linked than nothing! -Alan D
True. Well I suppose someone will pick it up. My last reading on it was in high school, though I suppose I could copy and paste. I'd rather someone genuinely knowledgeable about it do it, though. --KQ
In my mind, this extended text on ki does not have much to do in this article. It might feel natural to some aikido people, but I do think it would be better to make this one really short and transfer parts of it to ki. Habj 20:08, 2 Jul 2004 (UTC)
The recently added text may violate copyright unless it is added by the origin author.
Could you list the source you think it's from to help the rest of us check it out? :-) --KQ
I have no idea, but it was mentioned the writings come from "Aikido FAQ" and "The Spirit of Aikiko". Quoting the source does not get you the right to reproduce the text here, does it?
Is the link to Hara correct? The page seems unrelated. Can someone write a different page about Hara?
I have created a Hara page for the Japanese Hara called Hara (Fu), following the pattern of a previously existing page called Tanden (Dantian). The problem has arisen, due to the use of these two words interchangably and as synonyms, even though they have different meanings. Hara seems more to refer to a body part, the belly, while Tanden is more etheral a concept, being the centre of power and centre of gravity (assuming the stance is correct, of course). A Chinese friend who speaks both Mandarin and Japanese showed me that the characters are one and the same in both languages. I have resolved all links, ie Aikido - this page, to the new page. The old Hara page still exists, as it is a disambiguation page. I have made a link in it to the 2 new pages, as the terms are often used interchangably. As well, the old and incorrect Hara (Dantian) page should be deleted. I have removed all text from it and unlinked it, so I presume that it is gone.
While I was at it, I also corrected the links to Qigong and Tai Chi Chuan at the top of the section. [[User:Whiskers|whiskers (talk)]] 07:14, 15 Sep 2004 (UTC)
I corrected the links to a more widely used way in Wikipedia. The page Hara (Fu) would suggest that there is a category of Fu, which Hara is a part of. For example, see Assimilation (Star Trek) -- assimilation is under Star Trek. I corrected all the links, except for in this page (that would perhaps be a little intrusive, to edit others' comments). The page is now Hara (Martial Arts) --kooo 17:51, 2004 Sep 17 (UTC)
Hi, newbie here. I made a chart of the "genealogy" of Aikido some time ago, using the info found at aikidofaq.com, aikiweb.com and some other pages (urls of which i don't remember, sorry) related to some particular Styles. I thought it could be useful in Wikipedia, and converted it to ASCII art (sort of).
I need your help for corrections (I'm not 100% sure wether the info I used was completely accurated), and for NPOV (some may think that the inclusion of Daito-Ryu, Hapkido, Judo, or the Sportive Styles is biased in some way?).
The chart is here, I don't wanted to post it until you had revised it. Do you think it's worth including it?
Thanks! --ArinArin 11:38, 11 Mar 2004 (UTC)
As long as the arrangement is your own, and not taken from something else, then I definitely think it's worth including. It's a very handy, comprehensive summary.
A few points:
- Gwalla 23:48, Mar 13, 2004 (UTC)
I'd move Kano to Kito-ryu. If you make this its own article (which you probably should), then including ancestors for aikijutsu is fine. You'll want to convert it to a form that can be displayed on Wikipedia though--I don't think posting it in Excel form would be a good idea.
You could post the untranslated version to the Catalonian Wikipedia too.
- Gwalla 21:25, Apr 20, 2004 (UTC)
Aikido Schools of Ueshiba is as far as I understand not independent of the Aikikai, but very much a part of it. If you mention this org. I think you should list all the federations in the US affiliated with the Aikikai, as well as Swedish Aikikai, British Aikikai... Habj 00:28, 13 Jun 2004 (UTC)
I have recently updated the Aikido page by posting sections pertaining to the Body and Mind. I felt that if there was a section on Spirituality and Ki, a section on the Body and Mind would give a well rounded sense of the diversity of Aikido. I noticed today that in both of the new sections, someone has taken out links where I have learned some of my information from. I sited the sections of the text that were paraphrased and don't understand why they were taken out. I would like the person that edited the text to provide an explanation if possible. Cviggian
I was wondering if anyone has any pictures of videos showing the so called "unbendable arm"? It has been described as an impressive display of the power of ki, all the way down to a simple parlor trick. The unbendable arm is a demonstration where the demonstrator extends his arm and challenges others to bend it. Sounds simple right? By "extending ki" through his arm, the demonstrator can make it impossible for anyone to bend it. This sounds really cool and I really would like to see it with my own eyes. Any link to video or pictures would be awesome. Cviggian
Hi New face here made some changes. to origin and styles : Simon
Did the bokken link
Aikido is not developed from Chinese wushu. Habj 10:45 May 10, 2003 (UTC)
The kanji is not a pictograph. What you claim is a handle actually is part of the radical "steam".
Never heard that osensei was "disgusted with violence". I take it as a myth. Soft techniques exist in other types of jujutsu also, although some aikido people like to think they are exclusive for aikido... Despite the name, it is kind of difficult to say that all aikido practise "f
Are Paolo Corallini and Ulf Evenas really famous enough to apper in "List of Famous Aikidoka" in your opinion? I have never heard of them outside Wikipedia. jni 11:57, 23 Sep 2004 (UTC)
I am myself quite ambivalent about this idea. What would you think about adding a list of aikido techniques/attacks here? Perhaps on a single page, with short definitions of, say, irimi-nage, ikkyo/ikkajo, kaiten-nage, etc. I think this would provide useful information, but at the same time it might be overly ambitious, especially when stylistic differences come into play. (Are we really qualified to describe the fundamental, trans-stylistic essence of, say, yonkyo?) I'd like some feedback before I make such a move.
Edwinstearns 15:40, 25 Oct 2004 (UTC)
I deleted the description of ASU because:
I think that we should be carefull that this page doesn't become a series of promotions for induvidual styles. This will only result edit wars as some people will always feel that their style has been slighted in some way. Let's try to keep the internal political fights of Aikido off this encyclopedic page and on the forums where they belong. Edwinstearns 14:24, 26 Oct 2004 (UTC)
I thought it would be best if people just filled in information about the styles they knew about. The page isn't meant to remain static. According to your logic, if one person can't equally extend the descriptions of all the styles, they must remain the same length forever. I don't think this is the best approach.
Torokun 01:27, 29 Oct 2004 (UTC)
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I was wondering if someone can perhaps create articles on both Koichi Tohei and Ki-Aikido. As of this moment there are no entries whatsoever on these two subjects. I would do it myself but I am not yet knowledgeable enough of the history of Ki-Aikido and Koichi Tohei to do it properly.
/Aikido-trainee 14:41, 25 Dec 2004 CET+1
Regarding this article here: can it safely be said that ki aikido focusses more on spiritual aspects and less on technique? I can imagine that depends on how you define spirituality, and how you define technique. I suggest we take that sentence out. Habj 19:18, 27 Dec 2004 (UTC)
"
???
Fred26, I am talking about the article that this talk page belongs to - aikido! Maybe I was unclear when I said "regarding this page here", but most of the time you assume that what is on a talk page concerns the article that the talk page belongs to.
I am discussing whether we safely can say that ki-aikido is more spiritual than other aikido. I argue that we can not safely say so. Habj 17:08, 4 Jan 2005 (UTC)
In some lines of aikido, all techniques can be performed with a sword as well as unarmed.
I wanted to pop by and inquire after the truth of water rituals as practiced by students of Aikido. Are there rituals which are the purely personal practices of a particular person or is this something more found more generally in the student body? For example, Shinto has water rituals akin to cold-water Dousing, are these studied by only a few people or is this practice observed by many? -
I also wanted to doublecheck the notion that the founder practiced dousing. Is this true? -
I ask all this to clarify elements of the fairly new dousing topic. -- Sy / (talk) 03:28, 29 Jan 2005 (UTC)
Isn't that section on the book a bit over the top? If we include that, IMO we should mention a similar number of European aikido people and there are many books that could be mentioned. To me it seems we are shifting the weight of the article a bit to something less necessary. Habj 12:45, 8 Feb 2005 (UTC)
I removed Nishio aikido from the styles section, since Nishio was a part of the Aikikai. Technically he had a very unique style, but we have to distunguish between organisastions and technical styles; a list like this has to be of organisations, or it is impossible what teachers have a style unique enough to be mentioned.
I do not know if Tissier has his own organisation or not, but until I have facts that this is the case I would like to remove Tissier Aikido from the list also. I'll wait a bit, though. /Habj 08:49, 5 Apr 2005 (UTC)
That's a nikyo in the photo, not ikkyo!
I don't see how this can be true. O-Sensei was alive at the time of founding and was the head of the orginization until he died. While it may be true that his son was instrumental in Aikikai's formation and that O-Sensei had little interest in orginizational issues, it seems to me to be misleading to say that he didn't found the orginization. I will change this unless someone can cite a source one way or the other. -- — Edwin Stearns | Talk 19:03, 19 Apr 2005 (UTC)
Please see hapkido to see the connection to aikido, aikijujutsu, & Sokaku Takeda.
I recommend deleting the paragraph detailing the argument that Aikido was developed from Chinese arts. As far as I know, this argument has no traction among historians of Aikido and I personnally see no evidence of it. When I see film of Ueshiba demonstrating his art before WWII, I see the art fully formed, much as it is now practiced. The differences are most likely from the developments of his students, not any change in his own thinking. The concepts of ki in Aikido that the author is refering to probably originated with Tohei Sensei and is studies of "Japanese Yoga" taught by Nakamura Tempu. I don't think that the article would be enhanced by a debate on this topic. — Edwin Stearns | Talk 13:11, 15 July 2005 (UTC)
I find this here as well questionable. It doesn't seem to fit with Ueshiba's character to hide his training. Additionally, he was rather opposed to most political climates concerning Japan. --Hidoshi 02:45, August 25, 2005 (UTC)
I noticed that someone changed 'nage' to 'tori' at one point in the article. I've heard a number of different terms for the two partners involved in practicing together; 'uke' seems to be pretty standard, but for the other partner I've heard 'nage', 'tori', and something that sounds like 'shay'. Are these varient readings of the same kanji, or terms that are used in different aikido schools? Nage is standard in Aikikai schools, as far as I can tell. Should there be some effort to pick a standard set of terms and give the others as alternates? --Clay Collier 01:10, 3 September 2005 (UTC)
This is tough since the three terms actually have a different meaning. With respect to terminology even Shihonage does not cut across all bounds. Avoiding terminology where possible seems like a good policy and if it really has to be used I think its better to choose the Aikikai version by weight of numbers alone.Peter Rehse 02:35, 6 September 2005 (UTC)
No I'm not one of them,(hehe), but I've just finished a major overhaul of the Shizuo Imaizumi article and I need someone more knowledgeable than me to check it out, especially the part about Shin Budo Kai itself. I have a feeling I haven't captured what Shin Budo Kai really is about in that paragraph in the Shizuo-article. Oh, I could also use some help with judging grammar, (english isn't my first language to begin with) wikification, NPOV and so on.. Any help would be..(will be?) apreciated. :)
I used the sources for the article described in "reference materials". Again if anyone feel it is not accurate feel free to tell me so. Fred26 12:33, 11 October 2005 (UTC)
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